PanjjaN paaniaaN dhota ik ik akhhar saadi boli da
SaaNjh sohappan maanan kaaran ehda i rus gholi da

I consider the accents spoken in areas other than where I grew up as sweeter ...that is not limited to only West Punjabis. One of my best friends is from RopaR district and I think his mother speaks very sweet Punjabi. On the other hand many of my pakistani friends tell me yaar tooN bahut mithi Punjabi bolda ain...so what is it? I think it is that all these people give respect to the other accents instead of saying degrading things about them like some folks..eh Doabaiye(replace it with lahoriye,majhail, multanis etc) baRhi bhairhee boli bolde ne etc. So for me case is closed..I think all accents are sweeter than Ambersari.:-)

Fahim ji, so feudals will not misuse Governmetnal infrastructure if you scare them of teaching Urdu instead of Punjabi to kammi kids? or they are stroign their tooRhi in school building because you don't teach tehm Punjabi? which is the case? I totally understand the problem of feudalims or administrative inefficiency but they don't relate to the medium of education in schools. of course that problem needs to be solved also for the overall betterment of the Punjabi society....although feudalism takes many forms...big land owners are only one form of it.

Tareekh Tamasha BukhaN Da, Tehzeeb Khadonna RujjaN Da
Tanqeed Jugalli LafzaN De, Tashheer Siappa Lujjan Da
Moseeqi Rattab Kuttian Da Tey Adab Gattawa MajjhaN Da
Per Ajay Qiamatt NaiN Aiee

At an office where I worked it was my "Uncle Ji" who taught me the correct structure.

Now about me being a Rajput. I call myself a Rajput not because I am racist or because that's my name, but because that's who I am. I am a Rajput. I am proud of my heritage. I'd be a racist man if I said I am better which I didn't. It's NOT racist to cherish your heritage and culture, but it is being proud of who you are. If I made the statements you did, then I'd be racist. I don't remember sayin' anything about who is superior or who is not. If I did, then please cite the proof otherwise don't sit there and try to judge me. If I am racist for callin' myself a Rajput, then, you are all racist for calling yourselves punjabis. Pride and racism are two separate things, atleast in my case. Judge me by what I said, not by my name. And, you asked "what the hell's all that(being a rajput) about?" It's about having a heritage that spans thousands of years. It's about the accomplishments of your ancestors, yours, and your future generations'. Go read about Dulla Bhatti, Prithavi Raj Chauhan, Banda Bahadur, and countless others. Once you're done readin' all that, then come ask me what "it's" all about. My ancestors are an inspiration to me; they give me a standard to live up to. Every morning I wake up, I swear by Dulla Bhatti's name to better myself. I am not racist, I am proud.

This is my last response to your unthoughtful words. A man who uses ad-hominem is not worthy of a discussion. I don't care about where you come from or where your pind is, or whether you're a jatt or a chamar. My criticism was based solely on your words, not your caste, religion, or anything else, but it seems as if that's all you have your in arsenals: personal attacks. And, dude, it's not "Papa" farid, or "Papa" bulleh shah; the word is BABA. Obviously, your "Uncle Ji," failed at teaching you the "correct" use of punjabi...LOL!...alright, I don't mean it, the last sentence was just sarcasm.

For rest of the punjabis, I apologize again if I offended anybody, but people who create divisions by callin' a faction better don't deserve any respect in my book.

LONG LIVE PUNJAB AND ITS PEOPLE

In regards to Sameer's comments about Panjabi. What I've seen in regards to the Pakistani Panjabis is many of the ones I know speak PANJABI at home (and in PUBLIC) and often speak it better than any of the "Sikhs".

What exactly does it mean to speak better Punjabi? It has different dialects, but it is Punjabi nevertheless. Different dialects are neither better nor worse, they're just that DIFFERENT. What's bad is if people start using hindu/urdu words in Punjabi. It's bad in the sense that it's not pure anymore, but I'm not sure what you mean by "better." Are you suggesting that Punjabi spoken in certain areas of Punjab is better than others? Religion has very little to do with how a person speaks. I'm not familiar with Muslim Punjabis that much, but I can tell you that Hindus and Sikhs speak the same in doaba and when you go to the amritsar area, the language as a whole sort of changes. The change is not because of religion, but it is because it's just a different dialect. Let me tell what's not better: people like you assigning scores of goodness to how a person speaks. Now, that's not "better." Next thing you're going to say is that "pendu" punjabi is not as good as punjabi spoken by the "educated." You're not very different from people who claim that Punjabi is the language of the anpar folks. So, if you can't utter words of wisdom, well, then KEEP YOUR RACIST MOUTH SHUT. You should take some geology classes and, perhaps, you'll learn how species develop and develop differently from another because of the natural barriers. You can't expect the Punjabis from jalandhar and Lahore to speak 100% the same because of the distance that is between them... On a different note, why do you have quotes about the word Sikhs? Are you questioning the identity of the Sikhs? Please do clarify because I don't want to assume anything here...

My theory - dissenting views cheerfully accepted - is that no organization can plan or successfully urge the use of a language. Language grows out of the usage of people - and whether or not it is used, is dependent upon the language's usefulness in personal and working life. If punjabis do not speak and read punjabi, it is because they have decided (could be any number of reasons - financial, laziness, social, political) that they are better of with something else. It is a balancing act all the time.

There are a number of examples of governmental organizations trying to impose a language on the people - the French trying to preserve the 'purity' of french (did not succeed), India attempting to urge the use of hindi as a national language (did not succeed tho bollywood did create a common idiom!).

I will not even consider the possibility of Punjabi in the danger of extinction. The undercurrents I feel tell me of whole different, upward mobility. I see it unstopable trend, even in Pakistani Punjab taking place and rulers and ideology based supression are nothing but sandwalling. I am anxious because I like to contribute to expedite it. Just 15-20 years ago, it was Lata and Asha Singing in Punjabi movies and now Sukhwinder, Narula and Manpreet singing in Hindi movies. Whatever is one's opinion about Bally Sagoo, he has expedited the process using his skills in music. 15-20 years ago, there was no Punabi World Congress, no APNA, Zia Islamization, Sikhs under supression, Diaspora small and indifferent. And now just look around NY, NJ gas stations, real estate, Punjabi music domination, voices for Punjabi Language and so on. NO other south Asian culture has achieved anything closer to Punjabis during the last 20 years. Once you break off from the pack with a higher slope (mathematical), the writing are on the wall. Sure, there will be hurdles, temporary setbacks and stupidites along the way but the fact is that Punajbis have shot up like a lone star. The credit goes only and only to hard working Punjabis. DullaBhatti, it is human nature to see the fruits of their eforts in their lifetimes. That makes us anxious and motivates to expedite the process.

The momentum is created and once it starts snowballing in Pakistan, nothing can stop it. Believe me we aint seeing nothing yet. What you see and hear (against Punajbiat in Pakistan) is too flaky, manufactured and maintained by Mullah-military-bureaucracy axis in the name of ideology is inefficient, high cost-no reward and expensive enterprise that is unsustainable for an extended period. We have witnessed its ramifications recently and perhaps more to come. The future of Pakistan lies with the people of Pakistan which, in turn, lies with their affiliations that they can identify easily. The simplest way to identify is through local culture and society. Punjabiat for Punjabis is the natural way. As Punjabis succeed, so will Punjabiat. Let us be foot soldiers in this march towards success.

Despite all the efforts, Urdu has started losing out to English and no longer a competition to Punjabi. In the future, Urdu will remain as more like Sanskrit of Muslims whereas ligua franca will be their native languages.

Talking about personal stories. My father goes out every morning and goes to either a senior center, library or some other public place in the area. Today when he was getting out of the senior center a guy in his 60's called him from back.."sardar ji ki gall naraaz ho, kolloN di langh challe O?"...he turned back and he told me he knew it instantly it was someone from Lahore. This senior center is attended by lot of Indians but hardly any pakistani elders. So they met very warmly and started talking about places they knew on either side...My father has a good memory of area between lahore and amritsar and when the guy told him he has visited the villages of Burki an Kohri, that made an instant connection as that is my father's naanka pinDs and he has played in the streets there as a kid. They talked for long time and then topic came to language. At some point chaudhary sahib said that true that Punjabi is not being given respect and its place by the Govt and all paRhe likhe lok speak urdu in pakistan, but still masses speak the language and people are proud to be Punjabis. I think it is good to be proud to be Punjabis but that does not mean much if you are not proud of your language and culture. I have heard this argument before too that language is not dying as people in villages still speak it. I think that is a misconception and needs to be cleared in everyones mind. Those days are long gone when languages survived because people spoke them and they did not know any other language. In this century any language that does not have governmental patronage and is not spoken/written/used in the media will not survive the year 2101. Thats where APNA, Punjab society, writers forums, artists and media becomes very important. LET EVERYONE KNOW THAT THIS CENTURY IS GOING TO DETERMINE WHETHER PUNJABI IS GOING TO LIVE OR NOT. Any Punjabi who lives or will live in this century owes something to our ancestors, our mothers, our land and every pir paighambar, sufi and lover who have walked over the land of five rivers.

Baba Ji Guru Nanak De Hazoor Aqeedat Naal
Sach Nanak ik Kartar
Jad chahya akhhiaaN meet liaaN
Te kar liaa Rab didaar
Sach Nanak ik Kartar

AsaaN chaah sachche sarkar di e
Koi parvah neiN ghar bar di e
JinhooN moh maaya sansaar di e
Oh kis ja da sardar
Sach Nanak ik kartar

AsaaN sohne de sang la-yaan ne
SanooN Nanak rashmaaN bhaN-yaaN ne
Ik jag nooN sam-jhaaN Aa-yaaN ne
Oh vasda Dhaar cho-dhaar
Sach Nanak ik kartar

MeiN heeran aaN Rab Ranjhan di
Te goli apne saajan di
Eh arz sono ik wanjhan di
Saada kar deu beRa paar
Sach Nanak ik kartar

Har mann vich dera nanak da
Sab chaar chofera Nanak da
Jugg saanjh savera Nanak da
Oh chan chaanan parkaar
Sach Nanak ik Kartar

Listening to the first poem “Sikher Dopeher Sir Te”, if for a moment we assume that Shiv is not talking about himself as a poet, but rather as the personification of Punjabi language, the poem can be read as the sad story of Punjabi in West Punjab. It is all there - beginning with the opening lines “Sikher Dopeher Sir Te, Mera Dhal Chalia Parchanwan” to “Main Vi Keha Rukh Chandra, Jihnoon Kha Gaiyan Ohdiyan Chanwan” and then all the way to the last band ‘Lokan Mere Geet Sun Lai, Mera Dukh Te Kise Wi Na Jania – Lokan Mere Sees Chum Laye, Per MukhRa Kise Wi Na Jania – Aj Es MukhRe Ton, Pia Apna Aap Lukawna.”

I will, of course, keep on dreaming about more of Shiv, coming my way from Vancouver.

When you ask someone to give a suggestion on something or share his or her views on certain aspect of life, you either gain something or you lose something.

Gain: Approach, Ideas, Roadmap for the change.
Loss: Waste of time. If you did not find the thoughts and suggestions worth implementing (this is rare depending on the people you contact) then you may consider it a waste.
Procrastination or "Sustul-Wajoodi" : Now, this is when you know what you need to do and you have the roadmap as well. This is when you need to "i.m.p.l.e.m.e.n.t" and not let that knowledge get wasted. Just a suggestion!

For some people, it is easy to identify and suggest, whereas for others it is cool to implement. Probably, to each their own.

Saeed Farani: Here is some news item, I just copied from The News daily. Apparently there was a good seminar in Lahore recently.

'Feudals, bureaucrats behind Punjab division'

LAHORE: SPEAKERS of a seminar condemned the proposal to divide the Punjab province and held feudal barons and bureaucrats behind such a conspiracy. Holding the hatred against Punjab among smaller provinces a result of a series of unconstitutional measures, they demanded increased powers to smaller provinces to end their deprivation, revoking of amendments to the Constitution, equal increase in Senate seats for all provinces and revoking of the proposed technocrat seats in the assembly because it would bring corrupt bureaucrats to the assembly.

The seminar organised by a local Punjabi newspaper was chaired by former caretaker prime minister Malik Meraj Khalid, while other speakers included Chairman World Punjabi Congress Fakhar Zaman, journalists Mujibur Rehman Shami, Zia Shahid, Mudassir Butt, a social worker Tahira Mazhar Ali Khan, Dr Ajmal Niazi, Hameed Akhtar and Kanwal Mushtaq.

Malik Meraj Khalid said that certain adventurists earned a bad name for Punjab by imposing emergency and controlling provinces from the centre. 80 per cent SHOs in Sindh were from Punjab police which generated anger against Punjabis, he said.

He said that if the development programmes made under the leadership of Quaid-e-Azam were implemented, most of the economic and social problems would have been solved. He said that the military had been the biggest pro-status quo force in the country. Fakhar Zaman said that in fact feudals and bureaucrats were behind the idea of dividing Punjab. He demanded that charter of provincial rights should be written afresh, provinces be given more powers other than the constitutional rights, equal increase in Senate seats for all provinces and withdrawal of proposed technocrat seats.

He said that Liaquat Ali Khan was behind the decision of declaring Urdu as a national language. He said that Punjabi intellectuals and thinkers had served the nation more than any other. Tahira Mazhar Ali Khan said that Punjab had always sacrificed for the sake of national unity. She said that discussion about division should be discouraged to promote national unity and solidarity.

Des ba-des de dukhh di katha (An immigrant's Song)

There is a myth amongst the wise ones that "EITHER YOU ARE PART OF THE PROBLEM OR PART OF THE SOLUTION OTHERWISE YOU DO NOT EXIST" [Fine tuned by Little Me :)]
I will be interested to learn if Sameer JB has been involved in any efforts around the initiatives he brought up in his Paanch Nukaat. Bringing up the issues and identifying the steps that need to be taken is one thing; and is commendable to a certain extent. In a country like Pakistan, we are way past the stage of bringing up issues and identifying solutions(to a certain extent). We ought to begin implementing the solutions we recommend/suggest. No one will come and do that for us. I do not want to put anyone on the spot, but I am just curious.

We can also take a look at the profile and characteristics of certain immigrant populations in the west and observe their traits.
I twisted your question, mainly, as I do not believe in whys. But I do believe in whynots :)

Mukurmee Mohtarmee Saeed Farani: Probably, it's the school system that one should put the blame on. We were always taught and asked to produce 5 points, paanch nukaat and etc...

The above was indeed a poignant thought, khilafae tawaqqau. Was it an orginal thought or a borrowed one ? :)

All the friends, acquaintences, colleagues and strangers I came across in my life, would always share their personal life stories with me. I never asked anyone and never cared to delve into anyone's life history, but somehow people always confided in me. This driver spoke about his family, his kids and the fact that he could not pursue higher studies here. I told him that he should come out of the stupid notion that just because he is of xyz age therefore he is past the age of learning. He was a citizen but had his wife and kids back in amritsar and had to move here at the time of the sikh riots. Interestingly, this was the first sikh that I have met who was bald headed and clean shaved. I asked him if he was a sikh and he said yes. He also told me that most of the sikhs live in England. Or I should say most of the ones in his family lived in England. Strong community!By the time, we were nearing my destination, he told me an episode that he encountered after Sept 11th. Some drunken felows(Irish passengers) misbehaved with him and he was very upset because of that. He, ironically, identified the fact that his job was a very rewardless position. He could not stand up for himself or contact the police when any passenger misbehaved as the police would always side with the passengers and not with the driver. Also, all the more reason as he was dark skinned, he will be discrimanted against. Somehow, I had nothing to say to console; for I realized that whatever I will tell him would not be sufficient to give a clear cut route or way out of his misery. Simply, because I have not been there. He was not an illiterate or uneducated fellow. He had a masters in geography from India. He tried to open his own business many times, but it did not work out for him. I told him that running and managing a business is not everyone's cup of tea. I also gave him some suggestions before reaching my destination. My brother would have told me up front, "Zahra, Allah Kae Wastae...Dadi Jaan Kee Tarah Kee Bataen Mut Karo. You have not seen everything in life. Ok! Just act your age." [My brother and I are hardly a year apart.] As I paid the driver, he told me that it was very nice hearing your views and thoughts ...Bari Khushi Hoaee Aae Taudae' Naal Gul Kurkae.

At the end of the day, I am forced to conclude that life is a journey. We ran into people from all casts and creeds. We cannot stop everywhere and give and take at each station but somehow I really felt sad and a little bad for the driver as I did not have a viable solution to offer to his woe "discrimination." I mean, these cab drivers, work 24X7 and are mistreated like hell. Of course, they also drve crazily at times, but they are human beings. Also, from all parts of the world. In fact, many are from our part of the world. I insisted that he should have complained to his Union if he was not comfortable to call the 911. But he was hesitant due to his previous bad experiences in India with the law enforcing groups. We were near Battery Park, when he was literally in tears, while stating his experience with the drunken fellows. Just to build his morale, I told him that at least he was alive and breathing. What about those who went to work and never returned? He listened to me very carefully and did not say anything afterwards. But I did realize that one person's woe may not be other person's concern. So, if there are different fine layers in the society, who addresses the concerns of all layers? Should each layer has its own rep to voice and represent them? If there are 6 layers and only four of them have reps then what will happen to the rest of the two? Concerned Me!

We must understand also that most articles and opinions are a mix of objective and subjective opinions. No two people agree about everything in the world. Important point is that if the opinion is helpful in promoting Punjabi language and culture as a whole. His article does exactly that.

For us who have been born and raised to some extent in Pakistan and India, it will always be striking a balance between national as well as Punjabiat. Some will be more nationalistic, particularly when it comes to sacrificing Punjabi interests when they collide with the national ones. If for some unknown reasons, things change at national level with opportunities of relallignment, the united Punjab slogan will not look down as anti-nationalistic as it is today. It is almost certain that Pakistani Punjabis will oppose a united India as a pre-requisite for united Punjab. However, a united Punjab, against faltering nation states in the sub-continent and instead of creating another alliance with the Muslims to the west of Punjab, will have far greater appeal than joining Afghanistan, Tajikistan,...........Until then, a better understanding among Punjabis on benign (to nation states) common causes like promotion of Punjabi language and culture among Punjabis is the best path.

Some of the teachings of sufism can help bridge this gap when pluralism and diversity has been eliminated as a consequence of partition. As Kulmeet Singh writes that Sufism thrives in diversity and multi-religious society because it offers non-violenet means to compromising. The success of non-Sufi Islam in Punjab recently is the direct result of the loss of diversity and pluraity. The importance of Sufism, Bhagti movement and Guru Nanak's teachings have been reduced to history or literary value.

Having said all that, my vision of united or divided Punjab is prosperous and progressive. History of noble Punjabis can only provide a base or starting point towards this end. It will take lot more than Sufism, looking forward. In addition to promoting Punjabi language and appreciating modern Punjabi thinkers and writers, a united stand behind reason, humanism and rationality will bear more fruits in the future.

Being a non-religious but ardent supporter of Punjabiat, the pictures of historical figure serve no purpose for me. Not that I am not a fan of Sufi literature but, for me, 21st century paradidms demand lot more than obsession with Sufism only. Why four, why not 100 or none? It is funny that it has become a turn off for me to see the picture of a Punjabi lyricist, named Shamsher Sabdhu??? (apologies to DullaBhatti) so often on Punjabi CDs of paticularly of Surjit Bhidhrakhia. It is almost Lata Mangeshkar phenomenon all over again. Not that it is bad quality but it is just counter to competition from newcomers. Nobody could ever be as good as Bulley Shah, Iqbal or Ghalib, says who? To me Faiz was much appealing than Ghalib and Iqbal combined and hopefully future has in store for Punjabi better than Bulley Shah and Baba Farid.The best of Punjabiat has yet to come.

The internet is filled with sites that spew forth ignorant and divisive views. I had believed that APNA is a place where, through a sweet language and a profound literature, Punjabis could find their healing common ground. Singh, though, has a blind eye to history and present reality. He also has an insidious agenda, clearly stated. He suggests an understanding between Pakistani Punjabi Muslims and Diaspora Sikhs (not a new idea anyway)- he pointedly excludes Hindu Punjabis and Indian Sikhs, who, we are to suppose, are poor stupid sods brainwashed by bollywood into a state of non-punjabiness. Singhs statements re. alchohol, pork and cigarettes are a dead giveaway about his (mal)intent.

Three faiths co-existed in Punjab - Hinduism, Islam and Sikhism. Punjabi literature echoes with their combined theologies, philosophies and wisdoms. It seems to me to be contrary to the goals of APNA to endorse the divisive views of people like K.Singh.

I will give couple of examples from my personal experience. As a personal preference I don't eat pork(although I am sikh...does that mean I have to eat it since Farrana does not?:-)). I have to tell only once to my colleagues about it and never in future, when we go for lunch or dinner together and share the dishes,anyone will order pork. That is called being understanding and considerate. Manmeet being american born and bred does not probably know this that desis, regardless of our religious or regional affiliation, are some of the very inconsiderate people. We firmly believe in what we do is right and has prefernce over everyone else. Very evident from the previous message. Heck my mother-in-law thinks the way her mother taught her how to cook saag is the only and best way and everyone else amongst 120 million punjabis is doing it wrong for centuries...not to mention that is the way it is cooked in my house:-).

Tobacco and liquor is another example which we have big misconceptions. Most of Sikhs and Hindus think that Tobacco is integral part of Islam and that is why most Muslims smoke. On the other hand when muslims think about sikhs, a bearded guy with a bottle in hand is the image that comes to mind. I think Dr. Manzur Ejaz wrote something about it last year when he visited Indian Punjab. One time I was visitng some of my muslim friends and we were having good time and talking for hours sitting in a hotel room. Many of them were smoking and it became so suffocating that we had to open a window at some point. Then later in the evening couple of riends brought the beer bottles out. A couple of the biggest smokers in the room left the room (probably in disgust) that how could they drink beer/sharaab. Interestingly I don't drink and the guys who brought beers were also fellow muslims...Anyway, this is a touchy subject based on mostly streotypes that need to broken.

Zakki sahib, you write in very ThaiTh punjabi..how had you kept that alive. It is hard for a fish to survive out of pond(in this case out of pinD:-)). Here is a web page dedicated to Paash for you and Saeed Farani.
http://www.paash.net/
It almost all in Gurmukhi.

Dheensa: All HTML commands you need for writing bold characters and paragraphs are those b, /b and p all within brackets, the shift+, and shift+. Other commands are not really as important. Whenever you need to start a paragraph, just write bracketed p until you need another paragraph. For bold you need commands for begining bold and ending bold characters as mentioned in blue color above the window for interacting.

Hope this will help.

Last year as I was headed to Lahore via PIA, I ran into two interesting people in my seating row. One was an elderly and active lady from Gujrat and the other one was a young chap from Multan. Now, the lady and I exchanged pleasantries on and off. I had quite a few books with me to read and browse through during the 18 hour journey(flying time). She would ask me questions every now and then, despite my opened book. Anyway, I would talk to her in Urdu and she would respond to me in both Urdu and Punjabi. Then our conversation took an interesting spin and she started delving into her life's details: her sons, their wives, her daughters and family lands and etc. The lady was in clear white burraq dress. Now, after the layover in UK, she came back and started chatting with me and this time she did not want me to pick up my books and get carried away with them. So, she resumed her side of the story. This time she told me that mainoo urdu naeen changee tarah aandi tae main tuadae naal punjabi vich gallan karaan gee. I told her very politely, please go ahead. I can understand you very well. She told me about her daughters and their educational level. I insisted that she should let them work, get some exposure and not marry them off just because they have reached a certain stage. Very typical of me :)

On another note, there is a trend that I have observed amongst people from the belt: Gujranwala, Jhelum, Gujrat, Gujjar Khan...the Punjabi spoken in these areas can be easily deciphered by me[of course]. The educated class from these areas has a sweetness about them. Pata Naheen Kyoun? May be it is the water or the soil or the air? Anyway, it was a delight to talk to this lady. After a long time, my ears heard a certain sweetness. Now, I also started using certain expressions as my ears heard those from her. When I landed in Lahore that night/morning and was at the dining table with Ammi Abu...I started telling them about all the interesting episodes in the flight and then gave them a detailed account of my encounter with that lady. Interestingly, I gave the details of that encounter in the same format as I was told by my narrator. My parents were pleasantly surprised and amused. Just wanted to state a personal experience that listening comprehension adds a lot to one's fluency. It's the same with Arabic. Being Muslims, many of us offer our prayers in Arabic; can read and write very well; but cannot speak as we do not hear it being spoken in our surroundings. Something to think about!

This week's issue also has some other good articles about politics in Pakistan, by Khaled Ahmed, Ejaz Haider and Aqil Shah.

Musharraf is basking in the limelight of international attention lately. A pampered dictator could be very dangerous and irrational if allowed free hand to make or change laws with just one stroke of the pen. He has been changing laws and constitution left and right. Lets hope he does not divide Punjab into three as many non-Punjabis in Pakistan want.

. MaN Boli Da Sewak

The story of the kind-hearted farmer has not come to an end. There is a connection in that story amongst all the following elements:heart, soil, land, giving back to your neighborhood and community, mind ... ... ... ...In short, a weaver can weave and continue to weave a tale...but there is much more to that. As this weaver does not have enough time, therefore she would just give out the answer without creating many webs :)

I wish you every success and please keep up the crusade on behalf of second and third generation Punjabis.

Best wishes,

Sameer

1. Lower Status of Women: It is common malaise, countries from Morocco to Indonesia suffer while their non-Muslim neighbors have better literacy levels. I can go on describing how it effects are felt in higher population growth rate and male machismo and jingoistic policies.

2. Extension of Two Nation Theory: One world Kashmir says it all. According to some estimates, it has cost us about 35 billion dollars during the last 54 years with zilch outcome. India also shares this blame but being a large country and bigger economy they are much better to absorb the cost of their Kashmir policies. Other than Kashmir, it gives credence to religious and Islamists and even fundamentalists to claim more loyal to Pakistan than liberals and seculars.

3. Misplaced Priorities: The income at personal as well as national level is irrationally spent. At national level, excessive military spending resulting from regular military interventions in the internal affairs and beating the drums of animosity from India with the help of mullah and media propaganda, manufacturing consent in this direction. It is another story that they have always failed in protecting Pakistan (Bangladesh, Siachen etc.). At individual level, Hajj and Qurbani alone cost more than a billion dollars per year, decreasing the saving rates and spending in fruitful causes. The benefits of such spending are supposed to be materialized in distant future , after death.

4. Strong Center: In the name of unity and in the interests of highly centralized military commands, the rights of native cultures and people have been denied. In response people have to spent their energies trying to gain their cultural rights, which otherwise would have been spent in achieving progress in many fields including literacy.

5. Corruption/ Feudalism/ Tribalism: Much has been written on this topic. All I can say is that building institutions of democracy would decrease their influence. We need repeated elections not repeated military takeovers to tackle these problems.

IS MUSHARRAF A PUNJABI HATER?? I wanted to bring to attention one of the latest developments in Pakistan. The military junta has announced to add seats from tribal areas (FATA) to NWFP assembly in the next elections. Tribal areas should have been included in NWFP before asigning seats for them. This is federally administered area and not NWFP right now. It will increase the proportion of Pushtu speaking in the assembly in comparison to Hindko or Punjabi speaking population of the province. Until recently both groups were evenly matched and therefore the bills to make Pushtu provincial language and changing name of NWFP to Pukhtunkhwa could not pass in provincial assembly. In order to keep Nawaz and Bhutto out, Musharraf has been cultivating relations with ANP, MQM and other elements opposed to NS and BB. However, this is not the only reason in my opinion. He has been acting as a Punjabi hater from day one. He imposed a duffer retired general, Safdar, as governor who was a Punjabi from NWFP and not from Punjab. The guy was absolutely inept in running the province with hardly ever going out of Lahore during his two years. Then he imposed another Kashmiri general from the army day after his retirement from the Army. All the recent promotions in the military as well as all the important positions in his cabinet are filled with non-Punjabis, particularly Mohajirs, except for one stupid dummy named Sattar. The governor of State Bank, Finance Minister, Education Minister, Commerce Minister, Interior Ministers are all Mohajirs. I have no doubt in my mind that Musharraf hates Punjabi and Punjab like most of “Aslaf Mohajirs” (Aslaf is a mutually exclusive group of mohajirs who trace their identity to Arabs, especially the family and friends of Mohammed). Do not expect any help from Musharraf and his coterie in promotion of Punjabi culture!

Thanks to the strength of Punjabi culture, it is seeping into neighboring areas, national media and entertainment industries of India and Pakistan. Punjabis are becoming more successful and I am sure in 100 years or sooner they will leave neighboring cultures much behind in progress and prosperity with neighbors accepting more and more of Punjabi culture. Musharraf may be a temporary setback, he can not stop it from happening.

Does anybody have information about, and examples of, "lamme (lambe) geet"? Would really like to record some.

In this poem, I feel very different metaphors than Waris Shah (let's not start that discussion all over again). What I see in Heer in this poem is actually the plight of Punjabi woman. Ranjha is sort of emancipation. She is hoping for emancipation after fully realizing the culprits, who have been deciding, without being asked, her fate and her status in the society. She can think but can not speak out. The sadness of Heer is archetypal of general status of women in the society. Just a personal opinion!!!

Heer-Punjab

main nimaani dharat Punjaban, jiyon Ranjhan di Heer.
babul Choochak dhakka keeta, hoi aan leero leer.

sir te chhaaye zehri badal, te pairan wich zanzeer.
Satluj Jehlum lahoo piyaase, mere amman jaaye veer.

Kaidon chaachay kehar kamayea, khichi jadon lakeer.
Gur Arjun ton iyon vichhray phir mere Mian Meer¹.

vehrhay ne matrayean maavan, karsan zulam akheer.
jeebhay zandra, ann pakaawan, nainon tapkay neer.

'mullah'² mainu fatway chaarhe, 'pandit'³ kare taqreer.
'bhaiyean'⁴ aisee layee kalaawe⁵, jidan howan jageer.

main tatrhi da kehrha bailee te ki meri taqdeer.
panj aaban di laad ludakki ujj ughan jand kareer.

'Waris'⁶ mere akhan mundi⁷, baithe gunni guheer⁸.
na koi hauka, haal duhai, na haye koi peerh.

bauhrhi ve kitton aawe Ranjha, kann liyaave cheer.
main Saidde de boohe baithee, ho gai aan dilgeer.

main nimaani dharat Punjaban jiyon Ranjhan di Heer.
bauhrhi ve kitton aawe Ranjha aawe ban faqeer.
main Ranjhan di Heer.

1:   Mian Meer of Lahore, a sufi saint and friend of Guru Arjun layed the
      foundation stone of Golden Temple in Amritsar.
2, 3, 4:   Muslim, Hindu and Sikh fanatics.
5:   embracing someone and giving shelter
6:   Waris Shah. Waris mere = writers of today
7:   akhan mundi = closing ones eyes.
8:   gunni = one with wisdom and intellect, guheer = store, gunni guheer=treaures of wisdom
 

“Part II: The adamant farmer entered the office of the district head. He was routed to the waiting room. In the waiting room, he prepared his points once again. He was quite early and had the opportunity to revisit his thoughts. As his meeting began, he very firmly but humbly stated his plea. The division head listened patiently ..” and then

the division head took out a magic wand and murmured some strange arabic sounding words and then told the farmer that his petition has been approved. and lo and behold, magically a huge change took place in the farmer’s village: a nice 4-lane road from the nearest major city to the village; electricity, telephone, clean water through pipes and indoor plumbing, underground sewer pipes, high-speed internet access, a free pc, free tv and cable tv connection with many farming related channels for every house in the village. all kacha homes were converted to brick and mortar in the village and a fully-equipped hospital, primary and high schools and a college each for girls and boys and more.

the news of this miraculous change reached all corners of the world and agriculture/village development and other experts rushed to the farmer’s village. senior officials of world bank and imf were there. in a large press conference the farmer was asked the one question that was on the mind of all these experts, “how in the world did you do it?”

the farmer smiled and answered “all credit goes to zahra jee. she is the genius mind behind this. and now for all the dumb, stupid, illiterate farmers of the world (he also added 20 heavy duty claims of extra-everything relations with their three generation of relatives that i am omitting), and then said, i have just one message for your thick heads, the message that i got from zahra Jee: ALL YOU HAVE TO DO IS ASK – GET IT? you (another 20 of the same) – ALL YOU HAVE TO DO IS ASK!!!

the experts hung their heads in shame. they are now all trying to understand how they couldn’t come up with this brilliant but simple solution.

End of the story.

Sermon II: It would be the death of a community and culture when everyone starts thinking and acting alike.

Someone had mentioned their thoughts on Baesakhi...My "folk-story" never had the intent to be disrespectful. If anyone got offended, I apologize. I never knew that there was a link with Guru Nanak Jee as well. That's interesting to know. I am glad that my creative thought made me learn about this aspect. Now, I plan to write another write-up on life and the little doors it opens at each stage and step for us to learn about our own culture that we aren't well aware of. In that respect, moderation can be the hardest step. Being an extremist in anyway or shape may lead one to go on extreme ends of the pendulum; whereas, being in the middle would have to have one well acquainted with both sides in some respects. Just some points.

a) A hopeful outlook
b) A proactive approach
c) A laid back attitude
d) A give-in attitude
e) A responsible approach
...

Dear Apna Group: Can my story become part of a folk tale? Can it? If yes, please let me know. If no, please explain.

I don't think that Punjabis pronounce it as La-HOR. The tru pronunciation comes out as LO-UR or something close to that. Any suggestions.

Dullah Bhatti (real name Abdullah Bhatti) who became a living folk lore in Punjab during his lifetime, was a real-life hero if we look from the perspective of indigenous revolts and freedom movements against the tyranny of Mughal rulers. These movements had risen in Punjab from time to time throughout the Mughal rule and have mostly been ignored by modern historians as farmers’ revolts against land tax or lagan. Most of the histories of Punjab, as you know, were compiled after British armies finally subjugated Punjab in 1849 after some bloody fights. The one at Chillianwala was perhaps the worst military loss they ever faced in India. Most of their post 1849 scholarship in Punjab’s history is colored by their desire to convince Punjabis on the benefits of British rule and to favorably compare it with the past rulers. It was self defeating for their purpose to highlight the many Punjabi heroes who had struggled against the Mughal Empire. Not much work has been done on Punjab’s history after the Independence and most of what we read is a copycat of the research done by British historians – with some notable exceptions. It is no wonder that Punjabi hero’s like Dullah Bhatti remain a folk lore and not much historical research is done to put their life struggle in proper perspective. At any rate, here is very briefly what we know from the historical records:

Dullah's family, the Bhatti’s, had ruled a large area between Ravi and Sindh rivers that was named after Dullah’s grandfather, Sandil, as Sandil di bar. With Pindi Bhattian as their headquarter, Bhatti’s had ruled this area from roughly about 1335 – 1589. The last few decades of this period coincide with the height of Akbar’s rule. You can see the disadvantage that Bhatti’s story has. How can we view their struggle as legitimate freedom movement when from early grades in schools we have been taught that Akbar and rest of the Mughal kings were great Islamic heroes? Any way, to continue, Akbar had a real hard time in subjugating Bhatti’s who had refused to accept the supremacy of Delhi’s darbar, which actually became Lahore darbar during that time since Akbar had to live in Lahore for many years during his campaign against Bhatti’s and others in Punjab. We know that at least for three generations, Bhatti’s were a big source of trouble for Mughals. Dullah’s father Farid Khan and grandfather Sandil were both captured by Mughal’s after a major military campaign. They were hanged outside Delhi Gate in Lahore. Dullah who was a young boy at that time had to hide around while growing up. When he came to age, he organized a revolt against Mughals and soon recaptured most of the Sandil Bar’s area. In the ensuing brilliant gorilla and regular military struggle against Mughals, which lasted for almost a decade, he defeated many lashkars that were sent from Lahore to subdue him. His brilliance as a military and guerilla war commander, the elements of revenge in his story and the love and support he got from his own people captured the imagination of his contemporaries.

The Mughals were, in fact, never able to defeat him militarily until one day he was overpowered by a large Mughal army detachment while hunting with a handful of companions. He was taken to Delhi and presented at Akbar’s Darbar. Akbar offered him life and freedom if he would agree to end his struggle against him. Dullah flatly refused this offer and instead accepted the certain death. He was taken back to Lahore where he was publicly hanged. The famous Punjabi Sufi poet, Shah Hussain, was present at Dullah’s hanging and there are oral traditions about a fascinating dialogue between the two before Dullah was hanged. This is a real brief account but I guess it will be enough to give you some idea of why Dullah is still a folk hero in Punjab.

Older generation of Punjabis in the central Punjab, i.e., Rachna, know of this tradition pretty well but post partition generation has lost this part of traditional heritage.

It is always better to discuss and talk about similarities than differences when the purpose is to seerve Punjab, Punjabis and Punjabi Language. That is why, I believe that a discussion of religions often leads to the opposite direction because of varying levels of infatuation with their religion by Punjabis. Some try to overcome it by suggesting the similarities of sufism and Sikhism and concept of God. It is nothing new. This technique was tried centuries earlier called Bhagti movement, which did not succeed in decreasing the level of hostilities among Punjabis based on religion. Even those who adhered most to Bhagti movement (Sikhs) were prosecuted most in the history. Not just creating friendships and respect, even normalyzing relationships using similarites of religions or Sufism are likely to suffer from the built-in differences of belief systems. The strengthening of bond is not likely to materialize by closing in the gap of differences; tightening of cultural heritage and tradition bondings is much safer and better bet.

A person who does not respect and believe in the Punjabi cultural heritage and traditions does not really have any reason to be at this site. A person not believing or nominally believing in some sort of religion with strong love and respect for Punjabi cultural heritage and folk traditions ought to be equally welcomed.

General Note:

Right now, so much is going on at our borders, that I feel like saluting President Musharraf myself for his zest and zeal. I have developed great admiration for this man; and I pray and plan on doing so very regularly for his long life and the fact that may God grant him the strength as well as tenacity to stand by and implement his far-sighted and strategically well thought out plans. After years, Pakistan has had a real man as a leader. Previously, we've had clowns and retards from all walks of life; who came and stayed and played all the sick practical jokes that one could perceive; and exploited the nation like hell with their sick and repulsive agendas. May God grant President Musharraf a very objective, stable and peaceful life(Amen).

Sherpal:

"Children on the path drink the milk of the Quran and understand only its literal sense.The mature have their own understanding of its inner significance."

Sherpal:

"Children on the path drink the milk of the Quran and understand only its literal sense.The mature have their own understanding of its inner significance."